Sorry to be a stick in the mud, but I grew up in Barnesville and to me it's beginning to look like Forest Park or Jonesboro..I almost wish it were the quaint little place it used to be...
Sorry you feel that way. I've lived in Barnesville since I was a little boy. I moved away in my 20's and it didn't take me long to see the error of my ways, and I moved back here. Personally, I think Barnesville is still a 'quaint little place' and a far cry from Jonesboro or Forest Park. Yes, our town has its problems, but what town doesn't?
As a Gordon grad, it makes me proud every time I ride by the campus. I've attended four different colleges in Georgia, and Gordon by far is my favorite, and not just because I live here. Congrats to Gordon and its outstanding nursing department!
State employees are being furlowed and having their wages cut, yet at almost every college in the state funded university system we can afford to keep building new buildings and nicer dorms for students to live in and take remedial classes. Could someone explain!
Well for one the dorms were free, The company that built them makes the money off of them for something like eight to ten years and then gives the buildings to the college.
#3.1.1
Youcanloveit&stillwantchanges
on
08/22/09 at 03:05 PM
Does the company that builds the dorms and 'gives' them to the college also pay for staffing and maintenance of the buildings and grounds? If so, for how long? Does the company pay rent for the land upon which the buildings sit?
I tend to go by the standard of 'you get what you pay for...' - old school, I know.
Building projects are usually funded from bond issues, and personnel costs come from cash flow. I suppose the Board of Regents could order to a halt to all construction projects, but that money could not be used for payroll.
I suspect that at least for some colleges in the university system, the furloughs are a political rather than a fiscal necessity. The state legislature has had an attitude about college professors for a while. They do not get step increases in salary the way public school teachers and state employees do, and the avergae merit raise (i.e., total raise) during the Perdue administration is hovering around 2 percent per year. This year is the second of eight with no raises at all. Take-home pay has actually decreased over the past couple of years because of the increase in the employee health insurance contribution and furloughs.
Building projects create jobs while cost of living raises do not. Clearly, however, the Perdue administration is continuing its long-term project to gut the university system. Georgia now ranks very low in the southeast. Many Gordon college instructors already make quite a bit less than their counterparts elsewhere.
Gordon College is a real blessing to Barnesville, and quite frankly, it is a wonderful place to work in spite of the way it has been hobbled by the state government.
#5.1
Youcanloveit&stillwantchanges
on
08/22/09 at 07:04 AM
Good question Smokey and good answers, Nobody! This makes it more obvious that the whole system needs to be re-vamped! From pre-k to post grad!
Enrollment-up
Tuition-up
Faculty/staff pay- down
Building projects- out of control
The theory is- if you build it, they will come, but what if you can't afford to staff it, or for the up-keep, etc.? Plus, they can't afford what they already have...
Then, they raise tuition..vicious cycle! Our state has created the perfect educational financial storm.
Who will be able to attend these state-of-the-art facilities? Mostly those who depend on the government to pay (until it runs out of $)
Will quality nursing instructors want to teach at them with the threat of being furlowed or cut? They will probably get jobs at teaching hospitals and universities.
#6.1
Youcanloveit&stillwantchanges
on
08/22/09 at 09:47 AM
The employees are given the day(s) off without pay. Little known fact, most employees in the field of education sign a contract and on the salary line it says: state base + local supplement. Thereby giving the state and local school boards the upper hand. The state base can be reduced to Free fifty and the local supplement can be reduced to Nadathing.
It works by finding the daily amount for the days you work. So if you make 19,000 a year and work 190 days a year your daily pay is 100 a day. In the contract every teacher and professor sign there is a clause stating the pay schedule can be adjusted therefore they just make them take those 3 days off without pay because now they are only required to work 187 days. Hope that helps
Wonder how many of the upper administrators make only $100. a day? That sounds like a lot to most of us, but...Can you say, NONE. They are making a great deal more than that!
Who do furloughs hurt? The ones making the 19,000 a year (or less).
Go to www.open.ga.gov. Click on salaries and travel. Click on colleges and universities. Type in any particular name on do the whole school and you can find out what they're making- it's not even close to 19,000!
I just want to make it VERY clear that the systemic issues facing the university system are the result of state government, not anyone at the college. We are a happy family and have excellent leadership.
My mentors told me "If you aren't part of the solution, you're part of the problem"!
Your happy family is one small piece of the puzzle. And, if the systemic issues aren't addressed and corrected, could make the puzzle fall apart!
#8
Youcanloveit&stillwantchanges
on
08/22/09 at 02:58 PM
Nobody, good answer!
But, if the happy family goes along with systemic issues without protest (public and privite) then don't you become part of the problem?
I mean, at some point, don't you all join hands and sing Kum by yah- Then, "they" (where do you think the $ comes from?) build you a new 16 million dollar building and you all keep quiet about the trouble that lies beneath - like "are we gonna' be able to staff the darn thing and pay quality instructors without the risk of furloughs, upping the tuition so that only people who have gotten government grants can attend?" - The devil is in the details.
Can I ask a question? Who pays for doing things like moving a sidewalk two feet or lowering a brick wall
#9.1
Youcanloveit&stillwantchanges
on
08/22/09 at 10:04 PM
Or, builting a tunnel under college drive that can never pass inspection. The tunnel to nowhere..
It's a state institution, so doesn't the state pay for it? If so, that's not real money, now is it? Bonds for building projects, free dorms, free nursing buildings- administrators' salaries-six figures, before you know it we'll just be printing money!
What 'cha gonna do when the well run dry?
And where might we find information on your fabrication about the "unsafe" tunnel. May I inspect your engineering degree and licensure? Bold statements without backup.
Those small projects might have been included in the budget for the Student Success Center.
People teach at Gordon College because they believe in the mission. They also build lives in the community, and many are strong advocates for solutions to the systemic problems of the university system. I think someone can love his or her work and still advocate for change. There is no "part of the solution or part of the problem" dilemma. Many are simply powerless.
In the long run, continued pay cuts will hurt the entire university system because it will not be able to attract and retain quality faculty. That is the issue that the legislature and the governor must face. But the community or family of Gordon College and its leadership are strong. I do not think cynicism is likely to produce a solution.
But, they also teach because they are trying to earn a living..
As for the solution or problem dilemma...
You were the one who brought the legislative issues and the university system's problems with government.
Sounds like a problem that really requires a solution to me. (vote much?)
When many speak their power grows...
When many sit on their a** the power slows.
Power to the people!
Cynicism and realism are two different things- I'm a realist.
I'm guessing that you're a Gordon administrator. (please correct me if I'm wrong)
Build the building even if we will "not be able to attract and retain quality faculty." The quotes come from your comment, by the way.
Don't call me a cynic...
Why do we study history? (even ancient history)
Because we learn from the past..
Bet your history departmant will be ticked @ your comment. Or do they love, love, love you too much? (hearts)
My finger also pointed toward a 16 million dollar building, funding issues, legislative issues, staffing issues, not just being yes men (or women) and patting one another on the back. I like the Kum by yah comment made by youcanluvit...
Funny, you didn't respond to the remainder of my comments.
Particularly the one about your being part of the Gordon College administration.
Not that there's anything wrong with that....
Just makes you more likely to defend out of control spending and the exorbatant salaries of the administration.
www.open.ga.gov
Where are you guys going that you can make in the neighborhood of 100,000 (give 60 thousand or take a few thousand) and still need $5,000-$6,000+ in travel expences? Administrators Camp?-Kum By yah! Does real money pay for that or is it just the money you're printing on campus?
I don't like him, but I hope Sonny Boy can put a stop to that!!
If the tunnel was not safe it would be closed, but the tunnel is open and used everyday by students going from the main campus to the gym. If it was deemed unsafe it must have been some time long ago and corrected. Students and others use the intersection at the light to move between the main campus and the two academic buildings or the residence halls--it may seem like the tunnel is not used because you don't see the students who use it when you travel up and down College Drive by car. If you are on the campus you see traffic through there just as you see it on other pedestrian pathways but it all depends on which area of campus you are trying to reach. With two lights and two crosswalks I often get stopped at both--thank goodness for the tunnel or it would take even longer to travel down College Drive!
I guess you realize that the USG schools are state supported but 100% of their operations are not funded by state dollars. In fact smaller and smaller percentages of operations are. At some of the larger institutions the percentage of state dollars for support is very small--that is why some public universities in some states have considered separating from the states so they don't have to deal with politics.
Those more than 4,500 students who are at Gordon are paying tuition (or some have financial aid either federal, state (HOPE), or private funding) but they are paying tuition dollars that provide funds to the College. It just isn't as simple as some seem to indicate.
The Governor mandated all state employees take furlough days so state employees will take them even if their agency had a plan to provide services within reduced budgets. Furloughs mean people reduce their days, but it does not mean canceling classes or reducing services to students. No buildings or programs will be unstaffed. The nurses are moving from Smith Hall. It was built in 1939 under Franklin Roosevelt.....and it isn't built or configured to meet the demands of today's nursing education program. The nursing program is excellent -- just imagine what this faculty and program can do to address Georgia's healthcare shortage with this new facility.
I must assume your solution is to never replace a single facility, perhaps spend more and more money on maintaining older facilities that do not have the needed equipment or structure to teach modern subjects and expect Gordon to attract students and faculty to our area still the same.
Funding decisions for projects such as these were made years ago to address a state and countrywide shortage of medical personnel. That same shortage still exists and funds have already been designated, funds which by law cannot be shifted on a whim. Further, funds will be available for instruction in areas in which demands for graduates are so high. But I suppose you will run for office so we can vote for you to stop all funding to nursing related programs, as that seems to be your goal, right?
So there are three salaries at Gordon in six figures. And when you compare the salaries to the balance of the state, Gordon falls low or to the middle and these are out of control?
And I suppose it is obvious that the right way to grow an institution is to sit in your office and never take one step out. One should never attend state conferences or seek out continuing education opportunities or seminars. Traveling to seek out potential donors or contributors would be terrible as we should not expect anything but tax money to fund our state schools, right? I work in the private sector and this is not a good year, but I expect to spend as much as any of them on travel this year - except I don't have to be accountable for tracking it all so neatly. And, I don't think much of my travel will lead to funding for my company, state funds or private donations.
Maybe you should spent the rest of your days hanging out in the tunnel. The kids will probably wave at you as they pass by.
Lamar County is fortunate to have Gordon and I appreciate them and all that they do.
As a Gordon grad, it makes me proud every time I ride by the campus. I've attended four different colleges in Georgia, and Gordon by far is my favorite, and not just because I live here. Congrats to Gordon and its outstanding nursing department!
I tend to go by the standard of 'you get what you pay for...' - old school, I know.
Building projects are usually funded from bond issues, and personnel costs come from cash flow. I suppose the Board of Regents could order to a halt to all construction projects, but that money could not be used for payroll.
I suspect that at least for some colleges in the university system, the furloughs are a political rather than a fiscal necessity. The state legislature has had an attitude about college professors for a while. They do not get step increases in salary the way public school teachers and state employees do, and the avergae merit raise (i.e., total raise) during the Perdue administration is hovering around 2 percent per year. This year is the second of eight with no raises at all. Take-home pay has actually decreased over the past couple of years because of the increase in the employee health insurance contribution and furloughs.
Building projects create jobs while cost of living raises do not. Clearly, however, the Perdue administration is continuing its long-term project to gut the university system. Georgia now ranks very low in the southeast. Many Gordon college instructors already make quite a bit less than their counterparts elsewhere.
Gordon College is a real blessing to Barnesville, and quite frankly, it is a wonderful place to work in spite of the way it has been hobbled by the state government.
Enrollment-up
Tuition-up
Faculty/staff pay- down
Building projects- out of control
The theory is- if you build it, they will come, but what if you can't afford to staff it, or for the up-keep, etc.? Plus, they can't afford what they already have...
Then, they raise tuition..vicious cycle! Our state has created the perfect educational financial storm.
Who will be able to attend these state-of-the-art facilities? Mostly those who depend on the government to pay (until it runs out of $)
Will quality nursing instructors want to teach at them with the threat of being furlowed or cut? They will probably get jobs at teaching hospitals and universities.
Who do furloughs hurt? The ones making the 19,000 a year (or less).
Your happy family is one small piece of the puzzle. And, if the systemic issues aren't addressed and corrected, could make the puzzle fall apart!
But, if the happy family goes along with systemic issues without protest (public and privite) then don't you become part of the problem?
I mean, at some point, don't you all join hands and sing Kum by yah- Then, "they" (where do you think the $ comes from?) build you a new 16 million dollar building and you all keep quiet about the trouble that lies beneath - like "are we gonna' be able to staff the darn thing and pay quality instructors without the risk of furloughs, upping the tuition so that only people who have gotten government grants can attend?" - The devil is in the details.
Can I ask a question? Who pays for doing things like moving a sidewalk two feet or lowering a brick wall
It's a state institution, so doesn't the state pay for it? If so, that's not real money, now is it? Bonds for building projects, free dorms, free nursing buildings- administrators' salaries-six figures, before you know it we'll just be printing money!
What 'cha gonna do when the well run dry?
People teach at Gordon College because they believe in the mission. They also build lives in the community, and many are strong advocates for solutions to the systemic problems of the university system. I think someone can love his or her work and still advocate for change. There is no "part of the solution or part of the problem" dilemma. Many are simply powerless.
In the long run, continued pay cuts will hurt the entire university system because it will not be able to attract and retain quality faculty. That is the issue that the legislature and the governor must face. But the community or family of Gordon College and its leadership are strong. I do not think cynicism is likely to produce a solution.
As for the solution or problem dilemma...
You were the one who brought the legislative issues and the university system's problems with government.
Sounds like a problem that really requires a solution to me. (vote much?)
When many speak their power grows...
When many sit on their a** the power slows.
Power to the people!
Cynicism and realism are two different things- I'm a realist.
I'm guessing that you're a Gordon administrator. (please correct me if I'm wrong)
Build the building even if we will "not be able to attract and retain quality faculty." The quotes come from your comment, by the way.
Don't call me a cynic...
Because we learn from the past..
Bet your history departmant will be ticked @ your comment. Or do they love, love, love you too much? (hearts)
My finger also pointed toward a 16 million dollar building, funding issues, legislative issues, staffing issues, not just being yes men (or women) and patting one another on the back. I like the Kum by yah comment made by youcanluvit...
Funny, you didn't respond to the remainder of my comments.
Particularly the one about your being part of the Gordon College administration.
Not that there's anything wrong with that....
Just makes you more likely to defend out of control spending and the exorbatant salaries of the administration.
www.open.ga.gov
Where are you guys going that you can make in the neighborhood of 100,000 (give 60 thousand or take a few thousand) and still need $5,000-$6,000+ in travel expences? Administrators Camp?-Kum By yah! Does real money pay for that or is it just the money you're printing on campus?
I don't like him, but I hope Sonny Boy can put a stop to that!!
I guess you realize that the USG schools are state supported but 100% of their operations are not funded by state dollars. In fact smaller and smaller percentages of operations are. At some of the larger institutions the percentage of state dollars for support is very small--that is why some public universities in some states have considered separating from the states so they don't have to deal with politics.
Those more than 4,500 students who are at Gordon are paying tuition (or some have financial aid either federal, state (HOPE), or private funding) but they are paying tuition dollars that provide funds to the College. It just isn't as simple as some seem to indicate.
The Governor mandated all state employees take furlough days so state employees will take them even if their agency had a plan to provide services within reduced budgets. Furloughs mean people reduce their days, but it does not mean canceling classes or reducing services to students. No buildings or programs will be unstaffed. The nurses are moving from Smith Hall. It was built in 1939 under Franklin Roosevelt.....and it isn't built or configured to meet the demands of today's nursing education program. The nursing program is excellent -- just imagine what this faculty and program can do to address Georgia's healthcare shortage with this new facility.
Funding decisions for projects such as these were made years ago to address a state and countrywide shortage of medical personnel. That same shortage still exists and funds have already been designated, funds which by law cannot be shifted on a whim. Further, funds will be available for instruction in areas in which demands for graduates are so high. But I suppose you will run for office so we can vote for you to stop all funding to nursing related programs, as that seems to be your goal, right?
So there are three salaries at Gordon in six figures. And when you compare the salaries to the balance of the state, Gordon falls low or to the middle and these are out of control?
And I suppose it is obvious that the right way to grow an institution is to sit in your office and never take one step out. One should never attend state conferences or seek out continuing education opportunities or seminars. Traveling to seek out potential donors or contributors would be terrible as we should not expect anything but tax money to fund our state schools, right? I work in the private sector and this is not a good year, but I expect to spend as much as any of them on travel this year - except I don't have to be accountable for tracking it all so neatly. And, I don't think much of my travel will lead to funding for my company, state funds or private donations.
Maybe you should spent the rest of your days hanging out in the tunnel. The kids will probably wave at you as they pass by.
Sorry folks with reasonable posts - this one isn't aimed at you.
But feel free to be attacked and insulted by the ranting! It's more fun if we all get angry.